From cmsclaud at uga.edu Sun Aug 3 12:11:44 2003 From: cmsclaud at uga.edu (Claude Rubinson) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 12:11:44 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? Message-ID: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> Is there a utility out there for sorting columns of text? I have a dataset for which I want to reorder the columns of variables. (It would be nice to be able to specify the order of the columns but alphabetically would be fine.) One option would be to transpose the rows and columns, pipe the output through sort, and transpose the data set back again. Is anybody aware of transpose utility (rot won't work because it operates on columns of characters rather than delimiters and rs appears to be seriously broken). Thanks, Claude From jammer at weak.org Sun Aug 3 12:16:44 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 12:16:44 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? In-Reply-To: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> Message-ID: <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> $ man 1 sort -Jon On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:11:44PM -0700, Claude Rubinson wrote: > Is there a utility out there for sorting columns of text? I have a > dataset for which I want to reorder the columns of variables. (It > would be nice to be able to specify the order of the columns but > alphabetically would be fine.) > > One option would be to transpose the rows and columns, pipe the output > through sort, and transpose the data set back again. Is anybody aware > of transpose utility (rot won't work because it operates on columns of > characters rather than delimiters and rs appears to be seriously > broken). > > Thanks, > > Claude > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug From cmsclaud at uga.edu Sun Aug 3 12:33:38 2003 From: cmsclaud at uga.edu (Claude Rubinson) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 12:33:38 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? In-Reply-To: <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> Message-ID: <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:16:44PM -0700, Jon McClintock wrote: > $ man 1 sort I assume that you're referring to specifying a particular key column to sort by? That doesn't do what I need. Rather, I need to rejigger the actual columns (not sort by a particular column). So, if my columns are currently: foo bar baz 0 1 2 after sorting (alphabetically) they should be: bar baz foo 1 2 0 From atporter at primate.net Sun Aug 3 13:12:37 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 13:12:37 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? In-Reply-To: <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> Message-ID: <20030803201237.GK11204@primate.net> On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:33:38PM -0700, Claude Rubinson wrote: > I need to rejigger the actual columns (not sort by a particular column). > So, if my columns are currently: > > foo bar baz > 0 1 2 > > after sorting (alphabetically) they should be: > > bar baz foo > 1 2 0 So you want to scarf the first row, alphebetize the elements, and then jigger the rest of the file to fit? pear fig apple bosch mission galla asian beall fuji becomes: apple fig pear galla mission bosch asian beall fuji From cmsclaud at uga.edu Sun Aug 3 13:37:53 2003 From: cmsclaud at uga.edu (Claude Rubinson) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 13:37:53 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? (SOLVED) In-Reply-To: <20030803201237.GK11204@primate.net> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> <20030803201237.GK11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030803203753.GA8940@wagner> awk to the rescue! The following script does will sort columns by column headings. Requires gawk. To use Aaron's example: pear fig apple bosch mission galla asian beall fuji becomes: apple fig pear galla mission bosch fuji beall asian #!/usr/bin/gawk -f NR==1{ # read original column order into array # note -- index is column name, value is column number for(i=1;i<=NF;i++){ unsorted[$i]=i } # sort column names i=1 for(colname in unsorted){ sorted[i]=colname i++ } asort(sorted) # index is sorted order of column, value is column name } # output sorted columns { for(i=1;i<=NF;i++){ printf("%s\t",$unsorted[sorted[i]]) if(i==NF) printf("\n") } } From jammer at weak.org Sun Aug 3 16:21:35 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2003 16:21:35 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? In-Reply-To: <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> <20030803191644.GB20305@weak.org> <20030803193338.GA8672@wagner> Message-ID: <20030803232135.GC20305@weak.org> On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:33:38PM -0700, Claude Rubinson wrote: > On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:16:44PM -0700, Jon McClintock wrote: > > $ man 1 sort > > I assume that you're referring to specifying a particular key column > to sort by? That doesn't do what I need. Rather, I need to rejigger > the actual columns (not sort by a particular column). So, if my > columns are currently: > > foo bar baz > 0 1 2 > > after sorting (alphabetically) they should be: > > bar baz foo > 1 2 0 Ah. In continued brevity, I shall demonstrate: jammer at weak:~$ echo "foo bar" | awk '{print $2 " " $1}' bar foo -Jon "Off to Costco" From john at jjdev.com Mon Aug 4 11:37:47 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 11:37:47 -0700 Subject: [buug] Sorting columns? In-Reply-To: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> References: <20030803191144.GA7614@wagner> Message-ID: <20030804183747.GA4790@stang.jjdev.com> Check out awk On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 12:11:44PM -0700, Claude Rubinson wrote: > Is there a utility out there for sorting columns of text? I have a > dataset for which I want to reorder the columns of variables. (It > would be nice to be able to specify the order of the columns but > alphabetically would be fine.) > > One option would be to transpose the rows and columns, pipe the output > through sort, and transpose the data set back again. Is anybody aware > of transpose utility (rot won't work because it operates on columns of > characters rather than delimiters and rs appears to be seriously > broken). > > Thanks, > > Claude > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From al at eQuestSolutions.com Tue Aug 5 16:25:06 2003 From: al at eQuestSolutions.com (eQuest Solutions/Al Karaptian 805.520.7739) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2003 16:25:06 -0700 Subject: [buug] Linux System Administrator Opportunity Message-ID: Position Description Do you have experience with the hands-on leading of the build out of a Linux based Data Center? If so, please send me your updated resume to al at equestsolutions.com , as a word document attachment, and explain, in detail, all of your hands-on experience building out 100+ Linux server Data Centers including the number of Linux servers, design of architectures, kernel customization, all/any hands-on network engineering (including routers, switches, loadbalancing, firewalls and security) responsibilities, etc. that meet the requirements below. I will then call you to tell you all about the company, the position and team. Please note that all of your relevant experience must be detailed in the body of your resume to be considered by the hiring Director. If you are not interested, I was hoping you could help me out and refer me to a Sr Linux Administrator with Data Center build out experience that you have worked with or know of that would be interested in the following position in San Francisco, CA. I would greatly appreciate any help you can provide me and would be happy to provide you with a referral fee for any resulting placements. Location: San Francisco, CA Rate: open; Contract to Hire This software company is the industry leader in its niche and is looking for a Sr. Linux Administrator. This company serves many of the largest service providers, including AT&T WorldNet, EarthLink, MSN, Verizon Online, Lucent Technologies, eBay, Terra Lycos as well as a number of Global 2000 corporations. This company has been profitable for the last 3 quarters, has $10 million in cash and currently employs more than 110 people. The Sr Linux Administrator will be responsible for the complete build out of a brand new data center and architecture from scratch. The Linux Administrator will be a hands-on lead of the designing, architecting and deploying approximately 90-100 Intel boxes running Linux in a High Availability environment (currently pushing 80 mbps bandwidth), including evolving and managing production Linux builds and kernels. As a project lead, you will also be responsible for network (consisting of Foundry/Cisco routers, switches, firewalls), telecomm, storage, console, power, monitoring and security systems. You will also be responsible for the documentation of the policies, procedures and metrics. Company is also running Apache, ATG, Veritas HA/Netbackup, & Intrusion detection and is performing scalability testing with a wide variety of SMTP servers (Sendmail, qmail, postfix, exim). The company offers full benefits (PPO & HMO) including dental and vision, 401K, and Purchase Plans, paid vacation and sick days, Short and Long Term Disability, Life Insurance, an additional $120/mth to reduce transportation costs, casual dress and flexible work hours that all start upon employment. REQUIREMENTS: MUST have previous experiences leading at least one hands-on build out of a large (75+ Servers) Linux based, 24X7, High Availability Data Center. Must have 5+ years experience administering Linux servers in a large (75+ server) environments, including kernel customization, preferably on RedHat. Must have the ability to write customized Unix Shell Scripts and preferably Perl Scripts to automate System Administration tasks and monitor and analyze Linux Systems. Must have general networking skills, including: Hands-on experience with Cisco routers and switches down to the IOS level. Experience with Cisco Pix Firewalls and security systems. Experience with network monitoring systems (ProActive a plus), sniffers and SNMP Load Balancers; Foundry is a plus. Experience maintaining Linux servers for standard internet services such as DNS, NFS, DHCP, Samba, LPR printing, mail, web, and FTP service. Experience installing/configuring DNS/BIND. Must be comfortable having sole responsibility for leading the complete build-out of this Data Center, which will require the candidate to have a strong capacity for project planning and proposals, designing, documentation, leading and managing other staff and reporting. Company is unable to sponsor or perform Corp-to-Corp contracts with H1 Visa Holders. Company is unable to provide relocation assistance. Thank You, Al Karaptian eQuest Solutions Phone: 805.520.7739 mailto:al at eQuestSolutions.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wfhoney at pacbell.net Thu Aug 7 16:06:08 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2003 16:06:08 -0700 Subject: [buug] Blade servers Message-ID: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> Hi, Has anyone formed an attachment to a particular class/brand/make/model of blade server? I want to do a bit of product evaluation for my company; it's a low demand environment, probably not exceeding a dozen hosts for what we want to do in the mid-range future. It seems foolish to continually configure standalone machines for similar tasks. TIA (er...Thanks in advance)! Bill From jan at caustic.org Thu Aug 7 16:09:56 2003 From: jan at caustic.org (f.johan.beisser) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 16:09:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [buug] Blade servers In-Reply-To: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> References: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <20030807160902.N18247@pogo.caustic.org> On Thu, 7 Aug 2003, Bill Honeycutt wrote: > Has anyone formed an attachment to a particular class/brand/make/model > of blade server? assuming blade server means "1u", i've been very partial to supermicro (http://supermicro.com). > It seems foolish to continually configure standalone machines for > similar tasks. that's what jumpstart/pxe/autoinstalls are for. -------/ f. johan beisser /--------------------------------------+ The other day I asked former Yankees pitcher Jim Bouton what he thought of our great victory over Iraq, and he said, "Mohammed Ali versus Mr. Rogers." -- kurt vonnegut, 5.9.03 From atporter at primate.net Thu Aug 7 16:15:13 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 16:15:13 -0700 Subject: [buug] Blade servers In-Reply-To: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> References: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <20030807231513.GM11204@primate.net> On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 04:06:08PM -0700, Bill Honeycutt wrote: > Has anyone formed an attachment to a particular class/brand/make/model > of blade server? Unless space is at an extreme premium, I'd stick with 1U rackmount boxes. If you're worried about doing multiple installs, check out FAI/PFAI or YACI[1]. [1]. http://www.llnl.gov/linux/yaci/yaci.html From unixjavabob at yahoo.com Thu Aug 7 21:41:39 2003 From: unixjavabob at yahoo.com (Bob Read) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 21:41:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [buug] ebay needs a few kick-ass *nix admins Message-ID: <20030808044139.93159.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> Normally, I wouldn't spam buug with job info, but the economy is not what it once was, and I know how it goes, being unemployed for quite a while myself a year ago. I'm not a headhunter--I'm on the network monitoring team at ebay. Which means I setup the alerting and reporting for the servers, databases, and apps at ebay. I write the programs that nuke, webaboot, display real-time stats, and markup/down ebay's 2600 nodes. Ebay has a few open unix sys admin positions. I'll be in the Berkeley area on Tuesday if you want to talk about it. or call me at the number below. This job is really balls to the wall--and you will be walked out of the building if you don't know what you're doing. Ebay supposedly has the largest SAN fabric in the US. But if you are good at *nix, there is no place more rewarding. I love the people I work with/work for. And honestly, if you are at the top of your game, ebay will pay you to work with some of the coolest and most experimental hardware around. Ebay is not run by lawyers or accountants like most businesses...ebay is run by techies...this means "open season for open source". Let me know. Oh, yeah, its in San Jose...I have found it extremely difficult to get to/from Berkeley from San Jose, I wouldn't recommend it.... ===== ----------------------------------------- Bob Read Exit Code Incorporated cell (510)-703-1634 unixjavabob at yahoo.com ----------------------------------------- __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From harpo at thebackrow.net Thu Aug 7 21:45:21 2003 From: harpo at thebackrow.net (Will Lowe) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 21:45:21 -0700 Subject: [buug] Blade servers In-Reply-To: <20030807160902.N18247@pogo.caustic.org> References: <3F32DB60.6090203@pacbell.net> <20030807160902.N18247@pogo.caustic.org> Message-ID: <20030808044521.GA26178@thebackrow.net> > Has anyone formed an attachment to a particular class/brand/make/model > of blade server? The company I work for buys in bulk (sometimes orders of 100 or more at a time) and we have found that per megahurtz, the real blade servers -- the sub 1u sized ones -- can't compete pricewise with normal 1U servers. And they're a pain -- they need custom parts, sometimes special RAM, etc. ... there's no midnight trip to Fry's when the disk dies. For an installation of only 10, I'd definitely go with something a little more standard. -- thanks, Will From unixjavabob at yahoo.com Thu Aug 7 22:39:16 2003 From: unixjavabob at yahoo.com (Bob Read) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 22:39:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [buug] Blade servers In-Reply-To: <20030808044521.GA26178@thebackrow.net> Message-ID: <20030808053916.1451.qmail@web13808.mail.yahoo.com> I agree. Blade is too much of a departure from "what we know works", and is too expensive. IBM is screwing up the blade stuff as we speak, and doing a marketing blitz, but the truth is, there's no reason to get one unless you're building a giant cluster and you have space constraints....meanwhile, ye old standard config of motherboard, IDE drives, and slot-based cards keeps getting faster, cheaper, smaller, and more reliable. And supports wake-on-lan NICs, which is the key feature that you really if you want to "auto-build" your 10+ servers. My drug of choice is an n-U server with a 3-ware card...this gives you hot-swappable RAID on normal IDE drives, which are CHEAP. I got mine here (these guys underbid everyone I talked to and I think I got free shipping...can't remember): http://www.siliconmechanics.com ...or..check ebay...great prices on refurbished stuff, and almost nobody bids on it. Expect to get a top-of-the-line 1U for ~$300-600 refurbished/used. But if you get 10 servers, you should get them all the same model to save precious admin time. Bob R. --- Will Lowe wrote: > > Has anyone formed an attachment to a particular > class/brand/make/model > > of blade server? > > The company I work for buys in bulk (sometimes > orders of 100 or more > at a time) and we have found that per megahurtz, the > real blade > servers -- the sub 1u sized ones -- can't compete > pricewise with > normal 1U servers. > > And they're a pain -- they need custom parts, > sometimes special RAM, > etc. ... there's no midnight trip to Fry's when the > disk dies. For an > installation of only 10, I'd definitely go with > something a little > more standard. > > -- > thanks, > > Will > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug ===== ----------------------------------------- Bob Read Exit Code Incorporated cell (510)-703-1634 unixjavabob at yahoo.com ----------------------------------------- __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From psoltani at ultradns.com Fri Aug 8 09:29:09 2003 From: psoltani at ultradns.com (Patrick Soltani) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 09:29:09 -0700 Subject: [buug] ebay needs a few kick-ass *nix admins Message-ID: <3DBB075EEB95944492E127F2B9A96FAFCF3182@ultra-exchange.ultradns.com> Hi, I think posting the jobs that you personally are aware of is a community service. I know several folks that are really good at all aspects of *nix and still looking for jobs. So, IMHO, keep it up ;-). Best Regards, Patrick Soltani. >-----Original Message----- >From: Bob Read [mailto:unixjavabob at yahoo.com] >Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2003 9:42 PM >To: buug at weak.org >Subject: [buug] ebay needs a few kick-ass *nix admins > > >Normally, I wouldn't spam buug with job info, but the >economy is not what it once was, and I know how it >goes, being unemployed for quite a while myself a year >ago. > >I'm not a headhunter--I'm on the network monitoring >team at ebay. Which means I setup the alerting and >reporting for the servers, databases, and apps at >ebay. I write the programs that nuke, webaboot, >display real-time stats, and markup/down ebay's 2600 >nodes. > >Ebay has a few open unix sys admin positions. > >I'll be in the Berkeley area on Tuesday if you want to >talk about it. or call me at the number below. > >This job is really balls to the wall--and you will be >walked out of the building if you don't know what >you're doing. Ebay supposedly has the largest SAN >fabric in the US. > >But if you are good at *nix, there is no place more >rewarding. I love the people I work with/work for. >And honestly, if you are at the top of your game, ebay >will pay you to work with some of the coolest and most >experimental hardware around. Ebay is not run by >lawyers or accountants like most businesses...ebay is >run by techies...this means "open season for open >source". > >Let me know. >Oh, yeah, its in San Jose...I have found it extremely >difficult to get to/from Berkeley from San Jose, I >wouldn't recommend it.... > >===== >----------------------------------------- >Bob Read >Exit Code Incorporated >cell (510)-703-1634 >unixjavabob at yahoo.com >----------------------------------------- > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software >http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >Buug mailing list >Buug at weak.org >http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug > From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 10:57:52 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 10:57:52 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from Message-ID: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> If I have a box with one nic and it has two IPs. Can I specify which one to use? I have this situation, the fire wall is set to allow on ip to get to one place and the other ip to another place. Being that everything goes out on one ip that's a problem. -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From atporter at primate.net Fri Aug 8 11:10:33 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:10:33 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 10:57:52AM -0700, johnd wrote: > If I have a box with one nic and it has two IPs. Can I specify which > one to use? > > I have this situation, the fire wall is set to allow on ip to get to one place > and the other ip to another place. Being that everything goes out on > one ip that's a problem. Google up on static routes. From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 11:08:32 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:08:32 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> they are both on the same subnet so I'm assuming I'll do something like route add -host [ip of dest box] gw [my box] ? On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:10:33AM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 10:57:52AM -0700, johnd wrote: > > If I have a box with one nic and it has two IPs. Can I specify which > > one to use? > > > > I have this situation, the fire wall is set to allow on ip to get to one place > > and the other ip to another place. Being that everything goes out on > > one ip that's a problem. > > Google up on static routes. -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From atporter at primate.net Fri Aug 8 11:24:01 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:24:01 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:08:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > they are both on the same subnet > > so I'm assuming I'll do something like > > route add -host [ip of dest box] gw [my box] or: route add -host destination-1.com gw my-ip.com dev eth0 route add -host destination-2.com gw my-ip.com dev eth1 From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 11:19:47 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:19:47 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808181947.GA11819@stang.jjdev.com> to test this I'm trying to I'm trying to use tcpdump and netwatch with no luck seems like I can't get either one of these to show IP and not name. I've read the man pages and tried tcpdump -f and netwatch -n they stil show names how can I see what is hitting me by ip? On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:24:01AM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:08:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > > they are both on the same subnet > > > > so I'm assuming I'll do something like > > > > route add -host [ip of dest box] gw [my box] > > or: > route add -host destination-1.com gw my-ip.com dev eth0 > route add -host destination-2.com gw my-ip.com dev eth1 > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From atporter at primate.net Fri Aug 8 11:32:35 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:32:35 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808181947.GA11819@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808181947.GA11819@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030808183235.GQ11204@primate.net> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:19:47AM -0700, johnd wrote: > to test this I'm trying to I'm trying to use tcpdump and netwatch > with no luck > seems like I can't get either one of these to show IP and not name. > I've read the man pages and tried > tcpdump -f and netwatch -n > they stil show names > how can I see what is hitting me by ip? `tcpdump -n -i eth0` works here. From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 11:35:32 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:35:32 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:24:01AM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: hum, this will do it for all traffic on that machine right? if so, this would probally break the first app's ability to get through the fire wall. basically I need it to work like this: the box is being a proxy and webserver. I'd like it to use the same ip that comes in to go out on like when requests come to apache on ip1 they should go out to on ip1 (proxied) requests that come on ip2 shoudl be proxied on ip2 is this possible? or would it be up to the app (apach in this case) to chose the ip to go out on? > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:08:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > > they are both on the same subnet > > > > so I'm assuming I'll do something like > > > > route add -host [ip of dest box] gw [my box] > > or: > route add -host destination-1.com gw my-ip.com dev eth0 > route add -host destination-2.com gw my-ip.com dev eth1 > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From wfhoney at pacbell.net Fri Aug 8 11:50:44 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2003 11:50:44 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <3F33F104.7080704@pacbell.net> Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:08:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > >>they are both on the same subnet >> >>so I'm assuming I'll do something like >> >>route add -host [ip of dest box] gw [my box] > > > or: > route add -host destination-1.com gw my-ip.com dev eth0 > route add -host destination-2.com gw my-ip.com dev eth1 Would the following work. route add -hose destination-2.com gw my-ip2.com dev eth0:2 ... assuming the IP was set up as with my-ip2.com routing through the second IP set up with ifeth0:2? From atporter at primate.net Fri Aug 8 11:52:58 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 11:52:58 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:35:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > the box is being a proxy and webserver. I'd like it to use the same ip that > comes in to go out on > > like when requests come to apache on ip1 they should go out to on ip1 (proxied) > requests that come on ip2 shoudl be proxied on ip2 What do you mean by "proxy"? Squid? What kind of request? From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 12:07:19 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 12:07:19 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808190719.GB11972@stang.jjdev.com> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:52:58AM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:35:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > > the box is being a proxy and webserver. I'd like it to use the same ip that > > comes in to go out on > > > > like when requests come to --> apache <-- on ip1 they should go out to on ip1 (proxied) > > requests that come on ip2 shoudl be proxied on ip2 > > What do you mean by "proxy"? Squid? What kind of request? apache will be acting as a webserver for some static content and being a proxy for the stuff that needs to get sent to the appserver behing the firewall From atporter at primate.net Fri Aug 8 13:06:58 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 13:06:58 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808190719.GB11972@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> <20030808190719.GB11972@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030808200658.GS11204@primate.net> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 12:07:19PM -0700, johnd wrote: > apache will be acting as a webserver for some static content and being a proxy > for the stuff that needs to get sent to the appserver behing the firewall Ok... and you have two interfaces on the same logical subnet, but only one of these can talk to the application server (because of firewall rules). Right? What's the problem with adding a static route to the application server's IP? From wfhoney at pacbell.net Fri Aug 8 13:12:00 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2003 13:12:00 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808200658.GS11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> <20030808190719.GB11972@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808200658.GS11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <3F340410.7010609@pacbell.net> Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 12:07:19PM -0700, johnd wrote: > > >>apache will be acting as a webserver for some static content and being a proxy >>for the stuff that needs to get sent to the appserver behing the firewall > > > Ok... and you have two interfaces on the same logical subnet, but > only one of these can talk to the application server (because of firewall > rules). Right? What's the problem with adding a static route to the > application server's IP? I think he has a single NIC with a primary and one virtual IP. >>>>If I have a box with one nic and it has two IPs. From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 13:16:08 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 13:16:08 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808200658.GS11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> <20030808183532.GB11870@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808185258.GR11204@primate.net> <20030808190719.GB11972@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808200658.GS11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808201608.GB12063@stang.jjdev.com> that is what I'm going to try On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 01:06:58PM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 12:07:19PM -0700, johnd wrote: > > > apache will be acting as a webserver for some static content and being a proxy > > for the stuff that needs to get sent to the appserver behing the firewall > > Ok... and you have two interfaces on the same logical subnet, but > only one of these can talk to the application server (because of firewall > rules). Right? What's the problem with adding a static route to the > application server's IP? -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From john at jjdev.com Fri Aug 8 14:34:43 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 14:34:43 -0700 Subject: [buug] which ip to send from In-Reply-To: <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> References: <20030808175752.GB11748@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808181033.GO11204@primate.net> <20030808180832.GA11787@stang.jjdev.com> <20030808182401.GP11204@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030808213443.GA12198@stang.jjdev.com> On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:24:01AM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 11:08:32AM -0700, johnd wrote: > route add -host destination-1.com gw my-ip.com dev eth0 > route add -host destination-2.com gw my-ip.com dev eth1 this worked but not with the gw I tried it this way then did it with the gw to be the same as the default gw (I'm thinking I could have just left that off) and it worked From atporter at primate.net Tue Aug 12 10:03:29 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 10:03:29 -0700 Subject: [buug] Junk/Moving Message-ID: <20030812170329.GP11204@primate.net> I'm on my way out of my Berkeley apartment. All of this stuff is strictly AS-IS! I know the Viewsonic works, but I don't have the time or motivation to test any of the other stuff. Let me know if you are interested in grabbing this before sunday: 1 Pentium (unknown speed), 4 SIMMs (unknown size), ATX motherboard, case, powersupply. no video, network, hard drive. 1 Pentium 3/550, 256mb ram, atx motherboard, case, powersupply, No video, network, hard drive. 1 Viewsonic 17PS CRT 2 Toshiba IDE CD drives, unknown speed, black faceplates 1 300W ATX Power Supply 1 KeyTronic PS2 keyboard (with "penguin" keys not windows keys) 1 Pile of parts from an apple airport (everything but the pcmcia card it seems) 2 "SilentDrive" enclosures from QuietPC.com 1 Stack of right angle pci riser cards for rackmount servers 1 SpeedStream 5250 SDSL Modem (used with Speakeasy/Covad SDSL) 1 USRobotics Courier v.Everything 1 Lucent 9110 900mhz Cordless Phone From atporter at primate.net Thu Aug 14 01:21:48 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2003 01:21:48 -0700 Subject: [buug] Specs Message-ID: <20030814082148.GJ11204@primate.net> Hey -- I ended up in posession of a pair of specs after tonight's BAD meeting. If you lost a pair of glasses please contact me ASAP. If I don't hear from someone by 6/18/2003 I'll just trash them. From wfhoney at pacbell.net Thu Aug 14 18:45:57 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2003 18:45:57 -0700 Subject: [buug] Per user cost for RSA SecurID cards Message-ID: <3F3C3B55.4050503@pacbell.net> Hi all, Does anyone have experience with generating one-time passwords using RSA SecurID systems? What's the shoot-from-the-hip cost per user to maintain this sort of authentication infrastructure? I thought it best to get a quick estimate from someone who's already been there before I delve into all the marketing literature. Thanks! Bill 8-) From brian at planetshwoop.com Fri Aug 15 04:42:27 2003 From: brian at planetshwoop.com (Brian Sobolak) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 06:42:27 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [buug] Per user cost for RSA SecurID cards In-Reply-To: <3F3C3B55.4050503@pacbell.net> References: <3F3C3B55.4050503@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <59167.63.73.213.5.1060947747.squirrel@webmail.psys.org> Bill Honeycutt said: > Hi all, > > Does anyone have experience with generating one-time passwords using RSA > SecurID systems? > > What's the shoot-from-the-hip cost per user to maintain this sort of > authentication infrastructure? > FWIW: We just went with one of these systems here and I heard from the IS wonks that the actual cards were about $70 a piece. I'm sure there's quite a variance. brian -- Brian Sobolak http://www.planetshwoop.com/ From jammer at weak.org Fri Aug 15 08:16:40 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 08:16:40 -0700 Subject: [buug] [tess_rogers@hotmail.com: Looking for experience Linux Kernel Developers] Message-ID: <20030815151640.GA11794@weak.org> Anyone? -Jon ----- Forwarded message from Tess Rogers ----- From: "Tess Rogers" To: buug-admin at weak.org Subject: Looking for experience Linux Kernel Developers Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 07:35:25 -0700 To Whom it may concern: I was hoping you could help me out. I am currently working with a couple of clients in the Northern California, specifically the the Bay area, who are looking for talented Linux Kernel Developers. If you know of anyone, I would love the opportunity to speak with them. I thank you in advance for your help. Kindest Regards, Tess Rogers, President TRA, Inc Tess Rogers, President TRA, Inc 408-776-8989 _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ----- End forwarded message ----- From unixjavabob at yahoo.com Fri Aug 15 12:58:25 2003 From: unixjavabob at yahoo.com (Bob Read) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2003 12:58:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [buug] Per user cost for RSA SecurID cards In-Reply-To: <59167.63.73.213.5.1060947747.squirrel@webmail.psys.org> Message-ID: <20030815195825.1886.qmail@web13802.mail.yahoo.com> Plus add in cost of lost time due to delays in SecurID application process. Sometimes takes a month here. --- Brian Sobolak wrote: > > > > Bill Honeycutt said: > > Hi all, > > > > Does anyone have experience with generating > one-time passwords using RSA > > SecurID systems? > > > > What's the shoot-from-the-hip cost per user to > maintain this sort of > > authentication infrastructure? > > > > FWIW: > We just went with one of these systems here and I > heard from the IS wonks > that the actual cards were about $70 a piece. I'm > sure there's quite a > variance. > > brian > > > > -- > Brian Sobolak > http://www.planetshwoop.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug ===== ----------------------------------------- Bob Read Exit Code Incorporated cell (510)-703-1634 unixjavabob at yahoo.com ----------------------------------------- __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From psoltani at ultradns.com Mon Aug 18 14:32:05 2003 From: psoltani at ultradns.com (Patrick Soltani) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 14:32:05 -0700 Subject: [buug] Per user cost for RSA SecurID cards Message-ID: <3DBB075EEB95944492E127F2B9A96FAFDDF740@ultra-exchange.ultradns.com> Hi > >Does anyone have experience with generating one-time passwords >using RSA >SecurID systems? > I have been running couple of ACE servers 5.x aka SecureID servers for a while now. You can do this only on the GUI version. qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq Not Available in TTY-Mode qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq x x x x x The One-Time Password Generation feature is only available x x x in graphical user interface mode. x x x x x x qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq >What's the shoot-from-the-hip cost per user to maintain this sort of >authentication infrastructure? $5k for the software and support; this may vary for you, we got them couple of years ago. $2k for 30 key-fobs + some software token/key-fob $4k for two Sun Netra T1 to act as primary and replica for fault tolerance and fail-over. Plus the cost of a 6 packs and an extra large Pizza and some patience to get it all working ;-). Regards, Patrick Soltani. From wfhoney at pacbell.net Mon Aug 18 20:01:16 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: 18 Aug 2003 20:01:16 -0700 Subject: [buug] Per user cost for RSA SecurID cards In-Reply-To: <3DBB075EEB95944492E127F2B9A96FAFDDF740@ultra-exchange.ultradns.com> References: <3DBB075EEB95944492E127F2B9A96FAFDDF740@ultra-exchange.ultradns.com> Message-ID: <1061262076.2969.4.camel@fontanka.woland.net> Thanks Patrick, Brian and Bob! This is exactly the grist that I needed to give the higher-ups! On Mon, 2003-08-18 at 14:32, Patrick Soltani wrote: > Hi > > > > >Does anyone have experience with generating one-time passwords > >using RSA > >SecurID systems? > > > I have been running couple of ACE servers 5.x aka SecureID servers for a while now. > You can do this only on the GUI version. > > qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq Not Available in TTY-Mode qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq > x x x > x x The One-Time Password Generation feature is only available x > x x in graphical user interface mode. x > x x x > x x qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq > > >What's the shoot-from-the-hip cost per user to maintain this sort of > >authentication infrastructure? > > > $5k for the software and support; this may vary for you, we got them couple of years ago. > $2k for 30 key-fobs + some software token/key-fob > $4k for two Sun Netra T1 to act as primary and replica for fault tolerance and fail-over. > Plus the cost of a 6 packs and an extra large Pizza and some patience to get it all working ;-). > > > > Regards, > Patrick Soltani. From wfhoney at pacbell.net Wed Aug 20 12:37:07 2003 From: wfhoney at pacbell.net (Bill Honeycutt) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:37:07 -0700 Subject: [buug] RPC + Megapath = Dialup Message-ID: <3F43CDE3.7080703@pacbell.net> This is in the spirit of kickin' 'em while their hurtin'. We have several remote sites which use Megapath for their connection to the internet. Megapath now tells us that they have begun blocking all ICMP packets traversing their network (DSL). This wouldn't be so bad, but our dumb terminals ping for a route before connecting :-( Anyone else have a story reflecting on the wise men from Redmond? From jammer at weak.org Wed Aug 20 13:07:53 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 13:07:53 -0700 Subject: [buug] RPC + Megapath = Dialup In-Reply-To: <3F43CDE3.7080703@pacbell.net> References: <3F43CDE3.7080703@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <20030820200753.GA14989@weak.org> On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 12:37:07PM -0700, Bill Honeycutt wrote: > We have several remote sites which use Megapath for their connection to > the internet. Megapath now tells us that they have begun blocking all > ICMP packets traversing their network (DSL). This wouldn't be so bad, > but our dumb terminals ping for a route before connecting :-( That's (ICMP blocking) dumb...and (I think) not RFC-compliant. Call Megapath's sales department and bitch to them. I don't think there has been a single security hole relating to ICMP ping traffic. -Jon From atporter at primate.net Wed Aug 20 16:10:14 2003 From: atporter at primate.net (Aaron T Porter) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:10:14 -0700 Subject: [buug] RPC + Megapath = Dialup In-Reply-To: <20030820200753.GA14989@weak.org> References: <3F43CDE3.7080703@pacbell.net> <20030820200753.GA14989@weak.org> Message-ID: <20030820231014.GF11415@primate.net> On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 01:07:53PM -0700, Jon McClintock wrote: > I don't think there has been a single security hole relating to ICMP > ping traffic. Smurfing (sort of), PingOfDeath. Certainly none recently though. From jammer at weak.org Wed Aug 20 16:22:35 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 16:22:35 -0700 Subject: [buug] RPC + Megapath = Dialup In-Reply-To: <20030820231014.GF11415@primate.net> References: <3F43CDE3.7080703@pacbell.net> <20030820200753.GA14989@weak.org> <20030820231014.GF11415@primate.net> Message-ID: <20030820232235.GC14989@weak.org> On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 04:10:14PM -0700, Aaron T Porter wrote: > On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 01:07:53PM -0700, Jon McClintock wrote: > > I don't think there has been a single security hole relating to ICMP > > ping traffic. > > Smurfing (sort of), PingOfDeath. Certainly none recently though. Both of those can be filtered out with specific rules, and not broad level ICMP blocks. IIRC, for smurfing, you block broadcast ping, and for POD, you block large ICMP messages. -Jon From john at jjdev.com Tue Aug 26 13:46:07 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2003 13:46:07 -0700 Subject: [buug] nohup Message-ID: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> I've noticed if I run a program in the background then log out it stays running for a while then seems to arbitrarily stop. If I run it with nohup then it seems to stay running. why? I happen to be running a app server called Zope. It is a program written in python. I'm using linux 2.4.21. -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From jammer at weak.org Tue Aug 26 14:09:28 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2003 14:09:28 -0700 Subject: [buug] nohup In-Reply-To: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030826210928.GF7732@weak.org> On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 01:46:07PM -0700, johnd wrote: > I've noticed if I run a program in the background then log out it stays running > for a while then seems to arbitrarily stop. > > If I run it with nohup then it seems to stay running. > > why? > > I happen to be running a app server called Zope. It is a program written in > python. I'm using linux 2.4.21. If a program running in the background produces output, it will block until that output is consumed (read). nohup is a simple wrapper that will consume that output. The alternative is to pipe the output to a file (to log it), or to /dev/null (to ignore it). -Jon From john at jjdev.com Tue Aug 26 14:25:40 2003 From: john at jjdev.com (johnd) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2003 14:25:40 -0700 Subject: [buug] nohup In-Reply-To: <20030826210928.GF7732@weak.org> References: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> <20030826210928.GF7732@weak.org> Message-ID: <20030826212540.GA13148@stang.jjdev.com> yea, that I know, but why does it eventually die if it is not run with nohup? On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 02:09:28PM -0700, Jon McClintock wrote: > On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 01:46:07PM -0700, johnd wrote: > > I've noticed if I run a program in the background then log out it stays running > > for a while then seems to arbitrarily stop. > > > > If I run it with nohup then it seems to stay running. > > > > why? > > > > I happen to be running a app server called Zope. It is a program written in > > python. I'm using linux 2.4.21. > > If a program running in the background produces output, it will block > until that output is consumed (read). nohup is a simple wrapper that > will consume that output. The alternative is to pipe the output to > a file (to log it), or to /dev/null (to ignore it). > > -Jon > _______________________________________________ > Buug mailing list > Buug at weak.org > http://www.weak.org/mailman/listinfo/buug -- Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --Henry Spencer (Usenet signature, November 1987) From psoltani at ultradns.com Tue Aug 26 16:30:14 2003 From: psoltani at ultradns.com (Patrick Soltani) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2003 16:30:14 -0700 Subject: [buug] nohup Message-ID: <3DBB075EEB95944492E127F2B9A96FAFCF31F9@ultra-exchange.ultradns.com> > > >yea, that I know, but why does it eventually die if it is not >run with nohup? here is the snip from man pages: Solaris: DESCRIPTION The nohup utility invokes the named command with the argu- ments supplied. When the command is invoked, nohup arranges for the SIGHUP signal to be ignored by the process. FreeBSD: DESCRIPTION The nohup utility invokes command with its arguments and at this time sets the signal SIGHUP to be ignored. If the standard output is a termi- nal, the standard output is appended to the file nohup.out in the current directory. If standard error is a terminal, it is directed to the same place as the standard output. Linux: NAME nohup - run a command immune to hangups, with output to a non-tty Regards, Patrick Soltani. From jammer at weak.org Tue Aug 26 16:39:29 2003 From: jammer at weak.org (Jon McClintock) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2003 16:39:29 -0700 Subject: [buug] nohup In-Reply-To: <20030826212540.GA13148@stang.jjdev.com> References: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> <20030826210928.GF7732@weak.org> <20030826212540.GA13148@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030826233929.GG7732@weak.org> On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 02:25:40PM -0700, johnd wrote: > yea, that I know, but why does it eventually die if it is not run with nohup? Most likely because the write(2) call eventually timed out with an error code, and the process "handled" the error by exiting. That's mere conjecture, though. -Jon From michael1cat at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 15:37:44 2003 From: michael1cat at yahoo.com (Michael Paoli) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2003 15:37:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [buug] nohup In-Reply-To: <20030826204607.GB13067@stang.jjdev.com> Message-ID: <20030828223744.8370.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com> nohup considered harmful(?) ;-) I generally avoid using nohup for several reasons, including: * pesky nohup.out files - most (all?) nohup implementations create the nohup.out files even if there's no output (or standard error output) at all, and are non-unique in their per home directory implementations, also potentially leading to unintended overwrites and such * ignoring SIGHUP - while at first glance this seems like a generally good thing, allowing the process to continue, typically when invoking login session exits and sends SIGHUP to its children, it tends to introduce other problems, as often it is desirable to actually be able to get SIGHUP to the process and not have it ignored (unless the process would normally inherently ignore SIGHUP). * It generally doesn't detach from the terminal - this can be a *bad thing* when associations, such as invoking login session, are no longer associated with the terminal * potential process group issues My general preference with such things is to fire them off under batch (or at), advantages being: * no pesky nohup.out file * SIGHUP can still be usefully sent to the process * process is cleanly invoked without a controlling terminal * eliminate all or most process group issues The only particular caveats I note with batch/at, is some vendors/distributions have default configurations which may be problematic (doesn't allow enough process to run under batch/at, or defers starting of batch/at processes at too low a load threshold, or runs batch/at processes at a niceness other than desired, or default allow/deny is different from that desired). These batch/at issues, however, tend to mostly or entirely be configuration "set it and forget it" type matters, which can generally be dealt with once, and then typically aren't of subsequent concern. --- johnd wrote: > I've noticed if I run a program in the background then log out it stays > running > for a while then seems to arbitrarily stop. > > If I run it with nohup then it seems to stay running. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com